If history shows anything, it is that there’s no better way to justify relations founded on violence, to make such relations seem moral, than by reframing them in the language of debt — above all, because it immediately makes it seem that it’s the victim who’s doing something wrong. — David Graeber

Debt has a destructive past. Societies characterized by widespread levels of excessive indebtedness, with few exceptions, almost always imploded.

Whether it’s war, poverty, or good old fashioned pitchfork protesting — there’s no ignoring the real dangers of what can happen when debt levels spin out of control.

In this episode, we talk to Rehan Huda, a prominent investment banker and leading authority in Islamic Finance, about some of the key lessons we can learn from the long history of debt.